Episode 202: Podcast Tours and the Benefits of Being a Podcast Guest with Haylee Gaffin

March 5, 2024

Chasing Simple Marketing


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Haylee Gaffin share the benefits of going on podcast guest tours like getting more visibility within your business & selling more products.

The Many Benefits of Podcast Guest Tours with Haylee Gaffin

One of my favorite ways to grow my audience is through being a guest on other podcasts. I started doing this during my first year in business, and it’s become the only growth strategy that I’ve used every single year in business.

Don’t get me wrong. At first, it was terrifying. I can remember the first interview I did so vividly. I pulled all of my shoes out of my closet, because I’d seen podcasters say their sound was best in there. Then, I wrote up pages and pages of notes and printed them out.

And so, I sat in my closet with my laptop and mic in front of me, constantly referring to my notes, and shaking like a leaf the entire time. I had so much adrenaline rushing through my body.

And now I barely have to prepare before an interview because it’s become so second-nature. Plus, the results I’ve seen for guest episodes is unmatched. They help my email list grow, they helped my book launch become such a success, and the backlinks to my own website are great for my own SEO.

Which is why I brought on a podcasting expert to share more about a Podcast Tour and how you can use one in your own marketing this year. My own podcast producer, and my dear friend – Haylee Gaffin.

Haylee is a podcast producer, strategist, and owner at Gaffin Creative, where she helps podcast hosts plan their podcast launch and create strategic content that serves their brand and audience. As the founder of Mic Check Society, a community for podcasters, and host of Clocking In Podcast, a podcast for professionals making their way in the working world, Haylee is on a mission to help hopeful podcast hosts grow their brand.

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Haylee Gaffin share the benefits of going on podcast guest tours like getting more visibility within your business & selling more products.

Haylee Gaffin is a podcast producer, strategist, and owner at Gaffin Creative, where she helps podcast hosts plan their podcast launch and create strategic content that serves their brand and audience. As the founder of Mic Check Society, a community for podcasters, and host of Clocking In Podcast, a podcast for professionals making their way in the working world, Haylee is on a mission to help hopeful podcast hosts grow their brand.

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Episode 202 – Podcast Tours and the Benefits of Being a Podcast Guest with Haylee Gaffin 

Amanda Warfield: One of my favorite ways to grow my audience is through being a guest on other podcasts. I started doing this during my first year in business and it’s become the only growth strategy that I’ve used every single year in business. Don’t get me wrong, at first it was terrifying. I can remember the first interview I did so vividly.

Amanda Warfield: I pulled all of my shoes out of my closet because I’d seen other podcasters saying that their sound was best in, in their closet. And then I wrote up pages and pages of notes and printed them out. I’m talking like five pages of notes. And so, I sat in my closet with my laptop and my mic in front of me, constantly referring to my notes and trying to turn them so quietly so the microphone didn’t pick up the sound of the paper, and shaking like a leaf the entire time.

Amanda Warfield: I had so much adrenaline running through my body. And now, I barely have to prepare before an interview because it’s become so second nature. Plus, the results that I’ve seen for guest episodes is unmatched. They helped my email list grow, they helped my book launch become such a success, and the backlinks to my own website are great for my own SEO.

Amanda Warfield: Which is why I brought on a podcasting expert to share more about a podcast tour and how you can use one in your own marketing this year. My own podcast producer and my dear friend, Haley Gaffin. Haley is a podcast producer, strategist, and owner of Gaffin Creative, where she helps podcast hosts plan their podcast launch and create strategic content that serves their brand and audience.

Amanda Warfield: As the founder of Mic Check Society, a community for podcasters, and host of The Clocking In Podcast, a podcast for professionals making their way in the working world, Haley is on a mission to help hopeful podcast hosts grow their brand. You’re listening to episode 202 of The Chasing Simple Podcast, and I’m your host, Amanda Warfield.

Amanda Warfield: This episode was brought to you by the Chasing and Simple Content Planner, and you can grab your own at amanda warfield.com/planner.

Amanda Warfield: How do I find time to create content without overwhelming myself? Where should I even be showing up in my marketing? How do I come up with fresh content ideas? Where should I be focusing my marketing efforts? What is lead generation anyways and how do I do it? Are launches still a thing? And most importantly, how do I put it all together to market my business strategically?

Amanda Warfield: Can I really grow my business without spending all of my time marketing? These are some of the questions that float around in your head when you think of marketing. Welcome, friend. This is Chasing Simple, where practical marketing strategy meets simplicity. I’m your host, Amanda Warfield, simplicity focused content marketing and launch strategist, speaker, educator, and author of Chasing Simple Marketing.

Amanda Warfield: I traded in my classroom lesson plans for helping creative entrepreneurs sustainably fit marketing into their business without it taking over their business, so that they have time to grow their business, take time off, and live the life they dreamed about when they first decided to go out on their own.

Amanda Warfield: When I’m working, you can find me working with one on one clients, such as The Contract Shop and Rebecca Rice Photography on their marketing strategy and copywriting, or helping my students simplify their marketing and launches. And when I’m not, you can find me spending time outside with my husband, Russell.

Amanda Warfield: Reading in our hammock, watching Gamecock Sports, traveling, or forcing our cats to snuggle me. If you feel overwhelmed by marketing, you aren’t alone. Many entrepreneurs find marketing frustrating, overwhelming, and simply an obligation. They know they need it, but they don’t enjoy how easily it can suck up their time when what they really want to be doing is the thing that they started their business to do.

Amanda Warfield: Which is why I’m here, to help make marketing simple and less time consuming. So that you can spend less time on your marketing and more time growing your business and doing what you love Each week I’ll bring you transparent conversations, actionable steps, and judgment free community to encourage and equip you.

Amanda Warfield: So grab yourself a cup of coffee or whatever your drink of choice is and meet me here each week for love, support, practical tips, and advice on uncomplicating your marketing and business. Let’s do this entrepreneurship thing together, shall we? There are a lot of different marketing strategies out there.

Amanda Warfield: From content, to networking, to speaking, to ads, and so many more. And with so many different marketing strategies, it’s easy to find yourself hopping from one to the next without seeing results. Especially when you see other entrepreneurs getting results from their marketing strategies. When you aren’t seeing any from your own and after hearing from listener after listener wondering which marketing strategy They should focus on I decided to create a quiz to help you narrow down Which strategies will be best for you based on your current phase of business?

Amanda Warfield: Head to amandawarfield. com / quiz to take it. Learn where you should focus your marketing energy and start seeing results from your marketing. Again, that’s amandawarfield. com / quiz. Haley, I’m so excited to have you back on Chasing Simple. And, um, last time, which I’ll link to this episode in the show notes, everyone, but last time we talked about really deciding what our success looks like for ourselves.

Amanda Warfield: And I think that was such an important topic. Especially at the time that, um, we recorded that, but you are such a knowledgeable expert. I can’t believe I haven’t had you back on the podcast before now. So, why don’t you go ahead and just introduce yourself really quickly, tell everyone who you are, what you do, 

Haylee Gaffin: who you serve.

Haylee Gaffin: Absolutely. Thank you for having me back. Um, my name is Haley Gaffin and I own Gaffin Creative, which is a podcast production company for creative entrepreneurs. And we have really kind of niched into the podcast launch and production space to take all the heavy lifting of. Running a podcast off of the creative who does not really like to do that, but then we also run a podcast community called my check society where we provide educational content, a Facebook community, and we have, um, monthly calls as well.

Haylee Gaffin: And then I’m also the host of clocking in, which is a podcast for podcasters. And if 

Amanda Warfield: you guys love the way the Jason Sibyl podcast sounds, Haley and her team are the ones that actually produce my podcast. It literally would not exist without them. Just straight up wouldn’t because I hate editing with every fiber of my being.

Amanda Warfield: They, they do it and they do it so well and it, they just make it sound so great. Could not say enough good things about Haley and her team, so just a little plug for them there. If you are looking for editing help because you also hate editing, they are my go to for sure. 

Haylee Gaffin: I appreciate that. 

Amanda Warfield: Okay, so today we’re going to talk about a podcasting tour and I wanted to talk about this specifically because I know that a lot of my listeners 

Haylee Gaffin: are 

Amanda Warfield: intrigued by the idea Of having their own podcast, but have maybe paid attention to things I’ve said and realized that it’s not no work.

Amanda Warfield: And there may be holding off on starting their own podcast. And so they want to just dip their toes in by guesting on other people’s podcasts. And I think this conversation about a podcast tour is going to be really beneficial to those that already have podcasts, those who maybe don’t even want podcasts, but want to grow their audience.

Amanda Warfield: in bigger ways and for those who are interested in a podcast, but maybe just not yet. So why don’t you go ahead and tell us what is a 

Haylee Gaffin: podcasting tour? Absolutely. I think, like you said, a lot of creatives don’t know if a podcast is right for them. And that’s one of the first things I talk to potential clients with, uh, is if you don’t have the time to pitch yourself to be on podcast to go and record those interviews and to promote.

Haylee Gaffin: The podcast that you have been a guest on, then you probably don’t have time for a podcast because that is the easier side of things. Um, and when I say easier, it doesn’t mean you’re going to get every yes. It doesn’t mean that you’re going to, you know, magically be on 100 podcasts a year. That takes a lot of work, but if you can like.

Haylee Gaffin: Spend the time finding the podcast that you want to be on, pitching those podcasts. You can get a sense of, is podcasting right for me? Do I enjoy interviews? Would I rather be talking by myself? So I learned very early on that I prefer solo episodes. Like I enjoy creating exactly what I want to say. But as time went on.

Haylee Gaffin: That got harder and harder and I started realizing I need interviews. I need to talk to other people. I need to find ways to repurpose. But that’s not going to be the case for everyone. So figuring out what you like. by interviewing on other people’s podcasts, and that’s where a podcast tour comes in. So, a podcast tour, you can kind of make it what you want it to be, whether you’re going all in, in Q1 or Q2 of whatever year, and you’re pitching every single podcast you possibly could for a specific reason.

Haylee Gaffin: So, there are two main reasons that you would want to be on a podcast. One is to get visibility, and Share your expertise with a new audience, and then the other is to sell something. For the most part, those are your two main reasons. And when you go on a podcast tour, you can either spread it out through the whole year to get visibility, or you can go all in at one time and that be your main goal and focus.

Haylee Gaffin: And you’re pitching a ton of podcasts to be on them within a certain time range. And you’re telling them, hey, I have this thing launching, I would love for it to go out by this date if that’s possible. And depending on how much they have going on, they can usually make that happen if it aligns with what they need.

Haylee Gaffin: So, 

Amanda Warfield: I know that this varies for everyone and everyone’s goals. But when you’re helping a client kind of come up with a podcast tour and decide if that’s right for them, what kind of numbers? Are you typically encouraging them to aim towards how many pitches do you encourage them to send versus and maybe you don’t even focus on this number versus how many you actually get on?

Amanda Warfield: What does 

Haylee Gaffin: that look like? Yeah, so for most of my clients are not trying to hit a ton of podcasts in a certain time frame, they’re looking to. Like, oh, I want to be on two podcasts a month. And what I like to lean into is unless you have a personal relationship with the podcast hosts, you have a 50, 50 chance of getting on their show.

Haylee Gaffin: So if that’s the case, you want to pitch at least double. Or more of what you’re actually wanting to be on. So say your goal is to podcast a month. You should be pitching this month for next month because it’s likely they’re not going to be able to book you in this month. If they can, that’s awesome. If not, it’s okay, you know, just plan ahead.

Haylee Gaffin: But if you’re trying to get on to a month, four to six a month at least. Um, and sometimes if you’re shooting for like really big podcasts, It’s going to, you’re probably going to want to shoot for 10 pitches every single month in order to land your two. 

Amanda Warfield: Okay, so then knowing that you want to pitch a certain number, how do you find podcasts to pitch to?

Haylee Gaffin: Yes, so there’s a few ways you can go about it. The one that most people are going to tell you is to go into Apple and find a podcast you love, scroll to the bottom and see the similar podcasts. But there’s a much easier tool that takes a lot less Work of you like going in and searching, and it’s called raf, it’s raf.com/graph, like G-R-A-P-H, and you can type in the name of any podcast.

Haylee Gaffin: So I’m gonna go in right now and I’m gonna type in chasing Simple and I’m gonna pull up exactly what it tells me similar podcasts are or, and this is podcasts that listeners will go in and. Like, if they listen to your podcast, they also listen to these other ones. So it basically creates a web. So I can see there are probably a hundred podcasts that I’m looking at right now.

Haylee Gaffin: And you could just kind of scan through all of them and see different podcasts that you could go in and pitch. And that’s based on one podcast that you enjoyed listening to. That may also be something your audience would want to listen to as well. Wait, how did 

Amanda Warfield: I not know this existed? So, okay, does this tool, does it only show active podcasts or does it, is that 

Haylee Gaffin: something you still need to research?

Haylee Gaffin: Oh, you know what? I’m actually not sure. I, I believe it’s only showing active because there was a time when my podcast was on a break. And I went in and searched, and I had six podcasts related to mine. And now that I’m active again, I have a hundred podcasts related to mine as, like, actively. 

Amanda Warfield: Interesting.

Amanda Warfield: Okay, so that cuts out a whole extra step, 

Haylee Gaffin: too. Yes. I would probably still make sure, like, because you’re going to go in and look at that podcast anyway to see what topics they’ve covered, I would still look and see that they’re active so you’re not wasting your time creating. A specific pitch for them.

Amanda Warfield: Okay, so going off of that, they find potential podcasts, how do they decide if it’s worth sending a pitch to? 

Haylee Gaffin: Yes. So, this is where your judgment kind of has to come into play. There are people that are going to say, like, don’t pitch to the smaller podcasts. Well, I disagree with that because even if a podcast only has 10 active listeners, those 10 active listeners are listening.

Haylee Gaffin: And so if you are jumping on to sell a service, those are 10 potential people that could work for you. Um, so don’t let the number and like, we can’t see those numbers, but don’t let a number that someone says, Oh, I only have 10 listeners a month. Don’t let that deter you, um, because there’s so much more you can do with it.

Haylee Gaffin: That particular interview, which we can get to in a minute when we talk about repurposing, but when it comes to actually pitching and deciding, oh, should I pitch this podcast, make sure it aligns with your audience. Make sure that the topic makes sense. The number of times that my clients have gotten pitches and all of my clients are in the creative entrepreneur space.

Haylee Gaffin: The number of real estate. Pitches they’ve gotten the number of garbage truck pitches. I have personally seen where it’s like Oh, I run a trucking company that art we specialize in garbage truck Management that does not make any sense for any of my clients. So don’t be the person that pitches that if you’re creative Don’t go and pitch a garbage truck podcast.

Haylee Gaffin: It’s not going to make any sense unless you specifically want to serve that niche in whatever it is that you do. And it’s a waste of your 

Amanda Warfield: own time, right? We’re all about keeping things simple, keeping things in the most efficient way we can. And if you’re sending pitches to things that aren’t going to do anything for your business, What’s the point?

Amanda Warfield: Which leads me to my next question. How do you get the most out of doing a podcast tour and guesting on podcasts? 

Haylee Gaffin: Yes. So there are three main benefits that I see podcasters looking to grow and gain from doing a podcast tour. The first is building authority and credibility. The second is. Increasing their visibility and brand awareness.

Haylee Gaffin: So the difference between those two is you’re building authority for longevity versus. creating brand awareness kind of in the moment. And maybe you’ll get some Instagram followers, or maybe you’ll have a few new people explore your website. Um, but then the third is repurposing content. And then there’s one more that is actually selling.

Haylee Gaffin: So to get the most out of it, I personally think that if you’re going to go on a podcast, selling should not be your priority. But you can offer like an incentive of, Hey, here’s a freebie. If you want a free, if you want to come learn more about whatever I talked about in today’s episode, or if you’re trying to sell something like a service or a new offering that you have mentioning it, but you should be specifically focused on that brand authority and credibility and visibility and brand awareness, because it will create more opportunity for you longterm versus.

Haylee Gaffin: Oh, I want to sell this 19 product, like. That’s not necessarily going to be the thing that drives your business in the long run. As far as actually like taking advantage of those opportunities, grow your email list while you’re on them. Offer that freebie. Instead of saying like, oh, come work with me, which obviously you can also say that, but get them in there with a freebie as well.

Haylee Gaffin: Say, you know, oh, I have a podcast budget worksheet. You can head to Gaffincreative. com forward slash podcast budget, and there’s a little plug for you. But if you do that, they can get on your email list. Then you can nurture them in the longterm, but they have likely just met you as a guest on a podcast.

Haylee Gaffin: They don’t know you well enough to purchase from you. So keep that in mind as you are going on a podcast tour and getting yourself in front of new audiences. It’s so 

Amanda Warfield: smart and I know that I’ve talked about this before on the podcast, but the reality of podcast listeners is that. They, there’s no easy way to click over, so if you’re just selling the likelihood of them being like, oh, yeah, let me go out of my way to buy this thing is so slim, but if you’re giving them a really great freebie, they’re much more likely to go out of their way to grab something for free.

Amanda Warfield: That sounds really, really helpful to them. So would you say that your call to action for all three types? For all three goals is a freebie or would you, for any of them, would you do a different 

Haylee Gaffin: call to action? You could definitely do a different call to action. I think the freebie is a great opportunity if you have one.

Haylee Gaffin: So for example, on this particular topic, I, as a podcast producer, work with podcast hosts. What we’re talking about today is very much Focused on the podcast guest. I personally don’t have an offering for you. Like I don’t have anything to drive you to me, but in the off chance that you are someone who wants to start a podcast, you now have my name, you now have my brand and you’re aware that people like me exist and that’s really all that I need.

Haylee Gaffin: When the time comes, they’re going to think, Oh, Amanda had that person on the podcast. What was her name? I’ll go look or I’ll DM Amanda. I’ll find out what it is. And that’s plenty for me. That’s plenty for most podcast guests. Now you can be very strategic and be like, Oh, I’m going to incentivize you to come follow me on Instagram, shoot me a DM.

Haylee Gaffin: That would be great if y’all want to do that. But like the purpose of brand. Visibility and awareness is to get my name out there. So, I don’t think a freebie is absolutely necessary. It doesn’t always make sense because I personally can’t serve guests in a way that a pitching agency could. You know? Yeah.

Haylee Gaffin: Okay. 

Amanda Warfield: So, going off of that, if you don’t need a freebie, necessarily in order to be a guest on a podcast. What, how do you know if you’re ready to be on a podcast tour and ready to start really guesting on 

Haylee Gaffin: podcasts? I think going in knowing what your goal is. So for a lot of business owners, I feel like they are afraid to start because they don’t know they’re speaking topics.

Haylee Gaffin: They don’t know what their long term offering is going to be. And I do think that’s a good flag for you to know whether or not you’re ready because Podcasts have a lot of longevity, they have a very long life, and if you are a brand designer going onto a podcast to pitch your web design services and in six months you realize I hate web design and I’m not going to do it anymore, you have a podcast out there.

Haylee Gaffin: That’s all about web design, and it doesn’t necessarily make sense, so I would definitely consider like, how long do I think I’m going to be in this role? How long am I going to offer these services? Am I happy with these services? And am I ready to speak on a topic? Without knowing where the conversation is going to go and can I do that?

Haylee Gaffin: Um, I’ll give you 1 example of where I had created an offering and I’m so excited. I pitched a client to put it on their podcast. We even talk about it in the show. I, it was a flop, the, the offering, it was like a group coaching program type of thing for podcasters and that still lives out there to this day.

Haylee Gaffin: It doesn’t exist. I never brought it back. Like, so just be very intentional about, okay, if I’m going to talk about something, is it something that’s going to live for at least a year on my website? Um, I think a 

Amanda Warfield: good rule of thumb for any growth marketing strategy, not just podcast tours, is to first launch it to your audience.

Amanda Warfield: With any offering and test it with your current audience, you’ve already nurtured because they’re going to be more likely to go for some kind of offer like that or some freebie if they already trust you right versus a growth marketing strategy. You haven’t built that no, like, and trust factor yet. And so going to someone else’s podcast or doing a newsletter swap or whatever growth strategy you’re working on, you haven’t proved.

Amanda Warfield: With an audience you’ve already nurtured that it’s a success. It might not be something that’s ready for a podcast or 

Haylee Gaffin: absolutely I completely agree with that and I think to Understanding that when you’re going on these podcasts Episodes and interviews, you don’t necessarily have to sell your services.

Haylee Gaffin: Um, it’s great too, but especially if you’re going on a podcast tour in order to learn whether or not your podcast or whether or not you actually want to launch a podcast. You have all the time in the world to craft exactly how you’re going to utilize your podcast. And you can learn from the experiences within each show.

Haylee Gaffin: So say you go on your first three or four episodes and you’re like, you know, I really would have rather talked about this thing. I didn’t feel as comfortable on this particular topic. You can shift that as you’re pitching in order to align it with what you want to do. Same goes for when you actually start your podcast.

Haylee Gaffin: You can go a few episodes in and realize I don’t like interviews or I don’t like solos and you have the opportunity to shift that and move it along to exactly what you want it to be. That’s such good 

Amanda Warfield: advice. Yeah, everything’s just an experiment, right, when it comes to marketing. Let’s get into the logistics of this.

Amanda Warfield: And I’m kind of thinking that we break this up into before, during, and after. How do, what are the steps, how do they prepare to pitch slash be a great guest? What’s the before process 

Haylee Gaffin: look like? Yes, so the before would start with doing your research. Um, using that chart that I mentioned, finding the podcast that fit you, but then when you are actually prepping to pitch, you need to be doing research on each individual podcast.

Haylee Gaffin: So step number one is do your research. Number two is crafting that actual pitch and customizing it. So if you’re offering. I’m going to be talking about two to three speaking topics of Hey, I would love to come out on your podcast and talk about, actually, this is what I, I like to see is I want to come on your podcast and talk about this, and this is why, but if that topic doesn’t align with your content calendar, here are two other topics that I could talk about the other thing with your pitch, it needs to be very custom to the person you’re pitching and their audience.

Haylee Gaffin: Here’s why. That it’s going to be a good fit for your audience. I know that you speak to XYZ because I actually listen to your podcast. There are times I’ve seen people like take the exact title of an episode and say, I loved your episode about and not even changing the title. They’re just copying and pasting.

Haylee Gaffin: Which, fine, like, I get you want to highlight exactly which episode, but I very rarely see someone who actually took the time to listen. And you don’t have to listen to a full episode, you can skim it, you can listen on 2x, you can fast forward, but make sure that The host knows that you know who their audience is, you know what their podcast is actually about, and you know the format of it.

Haylee Gaffin: So that would be step two, crafting relevant topics and your pitch. Can 

Amanda Warfield: I just say that podcast hosts can tell if your pitch is genuine and if it’s not. It’s so obvious between the people who did their research and who just did a quick Google search. When you’re pitching someone that’s unknown to you, or you’re unknown to them, maybe I should say, the fact that they may not know who you are, I think, isn’t really what matters.

Amanda Warfield: What matters is how genuine and how custom your pitch is. The amount of people that I’ve been like, I don’t have a clue who you are, but your pitch was incredible, and I know that you took the time to do the research. Absolutely. Come on as a guest. I’m all here for it because I know if you put that time into a pitch, you’re going to put that effort into the episode as well.

Haylee Gaffin: Absolutely. I actually got a pitch that wasn’t for a podcast guest, but it was rather a, someone who wanted to help create additional content for my podcast. And they actually went through my whole website, pulled out phrases that I use and used it in the pitch. And I was like, This actually makes me want to hire you.

Haylee Gaffin: Like, I don’t like cold pitches for services, but it makes me want to hire you. So yeah, definitely keep that in mind. Um, and then additionally, when you’re crafting these pitches, make sure that you are providing more benefit to the host and their audience than you’re taking from the host and their audience.

Haylee Gaffin: There are a lot of benefits for podcasts. guests to go on a show. But in return, the really, the only benefit for a podcast host is they’re not having to create the content that they normally would have to do for a solo. And they might get your audience if you share, but that’s a huge problem in any pod, like any niche of the podcast industry is guests don’t necessarily always share.

Haylee Gaffin: So if you can highlight That you’re going to share that you’re going to be around to answer questions of their audience. Those are things that the podcast host will see and like, like that just sets you apart from other pitches. So those are all of my, like, befores. There’s two other things that you could consider doing.

Haylee Gaffin: Um, one is highlighting your credibility. So if you have a speaking page or you have an about page, highlight where you’ve been a guest on other podcasts if you have. If not, that’s okay too. We’re in the process of building that. Um, if you’ve spoken at other conferences, events, retreats, anything, summits, online summits are my favorite.

Haylee Gaffin: Place to get speaking experience because I personally struggle this on a stage and speak But I am fine doing it behind a camera, you know, like very different experiences for me And you can highlight that so make sure you highlight that if you have That to back you up and you can even link to that in your pitch as well and then during the actual pitching process my biggest recommendation is to Uh, be professional and responsive.

Haylee Gaffin: It is really hard for a host to get a pitch, respond immediately, and then not get anything back. So like, be aware of your inbox in the days after. Follow up. I wouldn’t necessarily say annoy them, but following up once, maybe twice, if they responded, uh, at one point and then just kind of stopped. Because they are busy.

Haylee Gaffin: Most of the time, especially in our industry, podcasting is not their full time job. They have an actual job that they’re using to market their podcast, or using the podcast to market their job. So just be aware of that as well. The last piece of this is always be networking and building relationships.

Haylee Gaffin: This happens before, during, and after the pitch. So if you are a long term person and you’re like, you know, I really want to start doing this next quarter. This is the quarter you should start engaging with their accounts, following them on social media, making sure they kind of have an idea of who you are.

Haylee Gaffin: If you have friends that have been on the podcast, ask them for an introduction. Like it’s very, it’s very easy to build relationships and networking. When you actually plan for it, and, um, I think the final thing I’ll say is. Be aware of if you decide to have someone else pitch you, there are going to be podcast hosts that don’t like that.

Haylee Gaffin: I think Amanda is one of them. I think they’ve heard me rant about this before. Yes. I personally don’t love being pitched by other people. I. I do understand the reasoning, and here’s my, here’s my thought process around it. If you’re someone who is too busy to pitch yourself, you have two approaches that are easy, easy opportunities for you.

Haylee Gaffin: Have them pitch as you. Like, it is so easy to just give someone either access to your email, or You just copy and paste their pitches into your email. It’s that simple. Or, if they are pitching you, have them copy you and give you a heads up. Hey, I’m going to start sending these at 8 a. m. if you’ll go through and respond to every single one of them and say, Hey, I just wanted to reach out and say I love your podcast.

Haylee Gaffin: I would love to be a guest. I think that virtual assistant name has added all the information above, looking forward to chatting. That way it’s not just like, I’ve never spoken to this person, they don’t have time to talk to me, they had someone else pitch me. That’s, that’s how I feel about it is like at least have some sort of communication with me if you want to be on my podcast 100%.

Amanda Warfield: Yeah. And it’s even like you said, it can be, they did all the work and you copy and pasted it and it at least makes me feel like you cared enough to do anyways. You’ve heard me rant about this. They’ve heard me rant about this. I won’t spend a lot of time on it. But yeah, 

Haylee Gaffin: 100%. I will say too, there are podcast hosts that like, won’t take pitches of people who pitch themselves.

Haylee Gaffin: Because they think like, oh, they’re not qualified enough to have someone else pitch them, so. It’s, there’s like a, I don’t, it’s, it’s very interesting. It’s a weird industry. A great divide between the two 

Amanda Warfield: camps. Okay, so we’ve done the pitch. We have gotten accepted on the podcast. I know that you edit a lot of interviews.

Amanda Warfield: What separates the good guests from the great guests? 

Haylee Gaffin: Ooh, this is a I love this question. I hate when people say I love this question, but I really do. After editing so many podcast interviews, you’re like, I hear this phrase over and over and over again. Yes. So I actually do have quite a few tips. For the guest to be a good guest one is to, if you’re going to go on a podcast tour, or even just be on one, two, three podcasts, invest in a microphone, just do it and then understand how your microphone works because I have gotten plenty of podcasts that they use their computer microphone, which is awful, or they’ve used air pods, don’t use air pods, uh, you can use them to listen, but don’t use them As your microphone, it sounds really, really rough, worse than your actual computer.

Haylee Gaffin: Interesting. So if you take nothing else away, take that away. Do you have, 

Amanda Warfield: sorry, do you have a page on your website that lists like different, like mics and stuff? 

Haylee Gaffin: I do. I have, I can, we can link to it in the show notes. I’ll link to that. It has three, um, microphone options that I recommend. I don’t have the Blue Yeti on there.

Haylee Gaffin: That is a very popular one. And I do think, as I do this with the Blue Yeti. I, so here’s, here’s my thoughts around a blue Yeti. It is very popular. Most of my clients have them or started with them. And I think you can get a better quality sound for the same price. It’s just not as cute. Like my microphone was cheaper than a blue Yeti and it’s not very cute.

Haylee Gaffin: It’s just a black microphone. But, um, I do think that’s a good podcast guest microphone. If you’re like. Oh, I just want to use something easy. The other problem with Blue Yeti is most people don’t know how to use them properly, which is another reason I don’t. Necessarily recommend it does take a lot of research to understand the settings what side to actually speak into on your you’re doing it correctly already checked.

Haylee Gaffin: Yes. Yeah. But yeah, because you got on to me.

Haylee Gaffin: Once I started 

Amanda Warfield: working with Haley, she was like, um, you need to change the setting and the setting. And I was like, how do you know that you haven’t even seen it? But yeah. It’s fine. 

Haylee Gaffin: It’s fine. Yeah. Well, that’s, that’s my main reason for not doing a blue yeti, but if you have one, use it. Like I don’t, if my clients come to me and they have one, I’ve never tried getting you to switch microphones.

Haylee Gaffin: I don’t think it’s necessary. I think if you just know how to use it, it works great. So that’s my first tip for being a good guest. It’s just having solid client. Microphone, quality and audio quality. My second one is, and this is something that has come up a lot recently, is not, there’s a phrase we use in the podcast industry called Stepping on Lines, and it’s where, so I’m gonna have you tell me some, tell me about a cat right now.

Haylee Gaffin: Like one of your cats. Oh, cat. Oh. 

Amanda Warfield: Um, well, pad may just left 

Haylee Gaffin: me. Yeah. . Oh yeah. Mm-Hmm. . That’s stepping on people’s lines where you’re like constantly agreeing with them, or if you’re finishing their sentences. So like, if you and I are on the same page, but I’m taking a little longer to get it out, oftentimes a guest or a host will try to like help by finishing the sentence, but it interrupts the flow of conversation.

Haylee Gaffin: So that’s a, that’s the second tip for being a good guest is just learning not to step on lines. I think I’m actually pretty bad about that. That’s good to know. I don’t think so. I don’t think so. I mean, I know I’ve done it to you a few times already today. No, I would say, like, a yes every now and then is totally fine.

Haylee Gaffin: And then the other thing is, like, internets. You know, the there’s a delay sometimes. So, yeah, this is good to know. This is something that I need to improve. Okay. Okay. So what’s the next step? Um, okay. The next step is knowing how you want to end your podcast episode. So this goes for both the host and the guest.

Haylee Gaffin: If the host is like, okay, and where can people find you? And you start sharing a hundred places, people can find you. They’re not going to go look them all up. So my recommendation is to actually just look up or just say your website, if you’re a business owner and your primary social media presence, and then if you have an offering, don’t go and list every single thing out.

Haylee Gaffin: Um, yeah, it’s people turn off. The podcast episode, 

Amanda Warfield: I’ve got to be honest as a host, I would even say choose one, choose one thing. And if you do have your own podcast, that should be your one thing because you know you’re talking to podcast listeners, but I know that’s like my pet peeve when I’m interviewing people and they start listing off five things and it’s just like, all of these are linked in the show notes.

Amanda Warfield: Give them one action step. Cause they’re going to have all of 

Haylee Gaffin: these in the show. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Especially if like you felt filled out an intake form. And, you know, like, oh, they’re going to link to all of these. Um, I wouldn’t even, yeah, I wouldn’t worry about all of them. If you don’t have a podcast, because if we’re talking to, like, people who are looking to get on podcasts instead of driving traffic to theirs, I would do your social media.

Haylee Gaffin: They can connect with you and stick to you, um, instead of, like, oh, you can head over to my website. I mean, you could, they could find you, but if you want them to connect with you on Instagram or TikTok or wherever. 

Amanda Warfield: But yeah, if we’re building the know, like, and trust factor, where do you show up most? It’s probably going to be social media.

Amanda Warfield: Yes, absolutely. Okay, so any other tips for being a good guest? 

Haylee Gaffin: Uh, I think the last one is just share. Share because they have shared their audience with you. Make sure you share the podcast episode with your audience as well. 

Amanda Warfield: Which leads us into the What do we do after? So kind of share for us what we can do after the interview, after the episode airs to make sure that we’re getting the most out of the interview 

Haylee Gaffin: that we just did.

Haylee Gaffin: So the number one thing is, like I just said, share, highlight it to other people on your email list, whatever social media platforms you’re on. Do the work to actually highlight, Oh, I know what I’m talking about enough to be on a podcast. Yeah. And if you are someone who you’ve been on 30 podcasts, make sure that you’re finding ways to still share and it’d be big because if you’re here’s a problem I’ve seen in the industry and it’s not that it’s really, it’s a problem for.

Haylee Gaffin: The host or the guest, it’s more on the host’s end of like asking great questions because say I pitch this topic to you, this podcast tour and the benefits of being a podcast guest. If I go and pitch it to 10 other people and they all have asked me exactly what you asked me, I’m likely not going to share their episodes.

Haylee Gaffin: But if they’ve done a little. pre research to figure out, okay, Haley has talked about this on this podcast. What can I do to separate myself from that interview? Then I’m likely going to share it because one of my favorite podcast interviews I’ve ever been on, we steered so far away from podcast production and like got into deeper personal connection.

Haylee Gaffin: And I was like, that was a, that was probably my favorite interview. And I barely shared about podcasting and it was. Really great for me to be able to share it and like, say, you’ve never heard a podcast interview like this before, but on the other end of things. You could also consider how you can repurpose the content.

Haylee Gaffin: So, if you are someone who has your own podcast, you can do a feed drop or a repurposed episode where you’re highlighting, I was interviewed on Amanda’s podcast, I really, I actually did this with Amanda’s, and, or making a blog post out of it. So highlighting exact conversations you had linking to the blog posts that Amanda puts out, that would be another way to repurpose your content 

Amanda Warfield: for everyone listening.

Amanda Warfield: If you’re someone who’s like, I think I might want to start my own podcast. I might be interested in starting my own podcast. I’m actually going to link a couple different clocking in episodes. In the show notes, so you can listen to those that Haley already has this content that she’s created about starting a podcast and one of those that I’ve picked out to share is actually one of these episodes that Haley has repurposed from someone else’s podcast.

Amanda Warfield: And so if you want to see a little bit of how she actually does that, you’ll, you could check out the show notes and those different episodes and see that in the show notes. Yay, 

Haylee Gaffin: I do. I really have been leaning into repurposing interviews lately. Um, and I wouldn’t say like repurpose them every like back to back, spread them out over time, especially if you’re in a busy season and you’re like, I just don’t know if I have the capacity to record another episode this month.

Haylee Gaffin: There you go. You have an episode already recorded. But as far as. Sharing or like, what to do right after an interview is there is no better place to show up than on the post of the person who hosted the episode. So go to their post. If they drop episode, like, in the feed, you can ask them if they’ll add you as a collaborator on the post.

Haylee Gaffin: You can ask them. Hey, do you mind if I drop in and comment? Actually, they don’t even care. As long as you’re engaging on their post, go in and get and engage with their audience. Who’s asking questions, commenting, whatever it is, um, show up on their social media posts when it goes live. Okay, 

Amanda Warfield: so I’m curious if you have any tips, and you may not, but for repurposing episodes that maybe feel like five other episodes you’ve done.

Amanda Warfield: Do you have any tips on how we can repurpose those without feeling like we’re just repeating ourself over and over 

Haylee Gaffin: again? Um, okay, I’ll push back a little bit because how many times does someone have to hear something for it to stick? And then You’re using my 

Amanda Warfield: own words against me, Hayley. 

Haylee Gaffin: I knew I would be.

Haylee Gaffin: And then the other thing is In every single podcast interview that you are a part of, that host is going to bring something new to the conversation that a different host didn’t or that you didn’t. The other benefit of repurposing content like that is that you’re more likely to sell to another audience than you are your own.

Haylee Gaffin: Like it’s so much easier to get What you do, what you offer out there. And I don’t think I realized it until I was working on client podcasts. And one of my clients never talked about her offerings on her podcast. But the second one of my other clients interviewed her, she like spouted off everything that they would need.

Haylee Gaffin: And I was like, you did so well in selling yourself. Why do you not do that on your podcast? And she’s like. I was just thinking that when I got off the interview with her. So it is so much easier to sell to a different audience that’s not yours. Um, because you’re trying to get into their audience versus your audience already has.

Haylee Gaffin: an idea of what you do, or at least you think they do. And sometimes they don’t like the number of times someone has come to me after they’ve launched a podcast and said, gosh, it was so hard. And I’m like, Oh, well I could have helped you. And they’re like, you are, apparently I don’t talk about launches enough.

Haylee Gaffin: So yeah, it’s always 

Amanda Warfield: so humbling when your audience lets you know, like you’re not doing a great job at selling yourself. 

Haylee Gaffin: Oh yeah, yeah, all the time I feel like that. Okay, so, 

Amanda Warfield: wow, you’ve given us a lot to think about and to take from this. If you could give everyone just one action step to take this week, what would it be to kind of get started on this whole journey?

Haylee Gaffin: Absolutely. One action step I would say is to start thinking about the topics that you want to talk about, the key takeaways, and potential questions. To provide to the interviewer. That way you are setting them up for success, but also setting yourself up for success because you may give a topic to a podcast host and they may not go in the direction that you want them to, that would guide them into whatever offering you have for that particular topic.

Haylee Gaffin: So whatever resource you want to guide someone to, make sure that you highlight, Hey, I have this. Would you please ask me this question? 

Amanda Warfield: Yeah, and even if you don’t have an offer, if you’re someone who’s just building visibility, there’s nothing more jarring than someone taking what they think your topic is about and taking you down this direction that it’s not about at all.

Amanda Warfield: And then you’re trying to figure out how to reel things back in to what you’re actually trying to teach. That’s, yeah, I learned that the hard way, so take Haley’s advice. That’s a great action. So, you have a membership for podcasters that I’m a part of, but I, and it’s geared mostly towards podcasters and that’s kind of how you market it, but I also think it could be really great for those that are just guesting on podcasts.

Amanda Warfield: So could you share that with everyone and just kind of tell them a little bit about what it is and how they might find it 

Haylee Gaffin: helpful? Yeah, so Mic Check Society is our community for podcasters where we offer educational content and, um, a podcast. Facebook group. Uh, so it’s all of our members are inside of a Facebook group.

Haylee Gaffin: We do two lives a month and then we have a call every month that everyone can join and ask questions. And as far as like non podcast hosts, we do have a lot of resources for audio quality, making sure that you have a good sound. And we are always coming up with new topics based on the The requests of our members as well.

Haylee Gaffin: Um, it’s also a great place. If you’re looking to get started in podcasting, we do have a lot of podcasters who are still in the planning process. They’re not quite ready to launch a podcast, but they’re exploring the idea of it. And, um, yeah, it’s, it’s been a fun, exciting community to, to host and be a part of over the last year and a half.

Haylee Gaffin: And we have made some really fun changes. over time. So yeah. And I also have a discount code for your community. Um, if you use the code chasing simple, you will get 10 off per month, making it 9 a month for your membership. 

Amanda Warfield: Oh, that’s amazing. Yeah. I would love to see you guys in there alongside me. The best way to get on someone’s podcast, I think, is to By having a relationship with them and this is a membership full of your ideal people if you’re trying to pitch to podcasts and that’s a great way to get your foot in the door and a really great way to be able to add a little we’re both in Hayley Gaffin’s Mic Check Society together kind of thing inside of your pitch.

Amanda Warfield: Just a little pro tip there for some of the ways that I like to um, position my pitches and how I often find people to pitch to is through memberships that I’m a part 

Haylee Gaffin: of. Yeah, and we even have the members that want to, uh, contribute, we have a directory inside of the dashboard. So it has, if you want to pitch them to be on your podcast, if you have one, or if you want to pitch to be on theirs, um, they can say like, yes, I would love to accept pitches, um, or.

Haylee Gaffin: No, I don’t want to accept pictures. So you can go through that and kind of explore. Should I even say I got your information from Mic Check Society? That type of thing. Love that. 

Amanda Warfield: Okay. One final question for you. And because you edit my podcast, you know what’s coming. If you could give everyone one book recommendation, doesn’t have to be business, can just be fiction, can be whatever you want.

Amanda Warfield: What would it be? 

Haylee Gaffin: This is interesting because I just got back into reading, um, like for fun. I was a business all the time kind of book reader and I realized I hated reading because that’s what I was doing. So, I, I’m, I’m sure at some point in the last year this has ended up. On your podcast, but I was introduced through Tick Tock, but it ends with us.

Haylee Gaffin: I do not know what about that two book series. I loved so much, but I finished it in four days, the two, both books. It was for me, that was mind boggling. I don’t read like that. So that would be my recommendation. If you’re trying to get back into reading, I really thought you were going to go with this is the hurt of the traveling pants.

Haylee Gaffin: I’ve been burned. I’ve been burned in case y’all are not aware. There’s a. I don’t know. Is that a fifth book? Fourth? Fifth? I don’t know. There’s a final book to the Sisterhood series. Like ten years later or whatever. Yeah, ten years later it came out. I think I was out of high school or graduating. I don’t know.

Haylee Gaffin: But it’s very depressing. It’s not good. So if you a depressing, sad end to a wonderful series. Read it. Otherwise don’t. I’m gonna pretend that book doesn’t exist for all of time. I still have four chapters left and I can’t finish it. It’s really not worth finishing. I don’t think it is. It’s literally sitting up there since.

Haylee Gaffin: Yeah. No. Oh, thank you so much 

Amanda Warfield: for being on again, Haley. And we’ll have to have you again at some point to talk about, you know, actually starting a podcast and what that looks like, because I know that’s going to be such a helpful topic as well, but I appreciate you 

Haylee Gaffin: for being here today. Thank you so much.

Haylee Gaffin: And if anyone wants to connect, I’d love to connect over on Instagram. It’s just at Haley Gavin.

Amanda Warfield: Thank you so much for joining me here today, friend. You can find this episode show notes as well as all the resources you need to simplify your marketing over at amandawarfield. com. If you liked what you heard here today, be sure to subscribe to the podcast so that you never miss an episode. And if you could take a moment to leave a rating and review, it would truly mean the world to me.

Amanda Warfield: Ratings and reviews are the number one way that you can support a podcast. And ensure that it sticks around for many more episodes to come. I’ll see you next time. Now go out and uncomplicate your marketing and business.

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